Far North

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Posts by Far North

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  22

  Hello....

  by Anne in

  1. jw
  2. experiences

  i've been lurking in this site for about a week now.

  i didn't know something like this existed or else i may have come sooner.

  i'm a bit selfish for making this my first post, but i'd like to introduce myself and get some feedback if possible.. my parent's became jehovah's witnesses when i was eight years old, so i was for the most part "raised in the truth".

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  Far North
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  126

  New Light on the United Nations (U.N.) (Scarlet Beast)

  by UnDisfellowshipped in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  there appears to be "new light" in the latest watchtower magazine (june 1st 2003 issue).

  several watchtower publications for the last 50+ years have said that the united nations (u.n.) organization ("the scarlet-colored wild beast" of revelation) would definitely be the organization that will carry out jehovah's judgment on "babylon the great" (false religion), and then, under satan's [gog of magog's] direction, the united nations organization would become "greedy", and try to attack the remaining remnant of the "anointed" jehovah's witnesses and their companions, the "great crowd" of "other sheep", and then jehovah and jesus would destroy the united nations organization, along with everyone else who was not a jehovah's witness.

  here is a quote that shows this: .

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  Far North

  I think many Witnesses are not even going to notice this change unless it is pointed out to them by an objective source. I could kick myself for all the hundreds of hours I spent over a 40 year period attending the Book Study to learn prophetic explanations that for the most part have been abandoned or changed.

  Many of us went thru the newer Revelation book 3 times and now some of it's key teachings are no longer considered valid! This is why I avoid the Book Study like the plague. Every verse of Isaiah is supposed to have a modern day meaning. The last time I went they started on the 1918 era and how major Bible prophecy was fulfilled at a Cedar Point assembly attended by a few hundred people.

  Many will say this United Nations disclamer is a clearer understanding and 'new light'. All it really says is "We were guessing and never really knew and now we have run out of explanations".

  If you can't explain prophecy untill after it is fullfilled you are just explaining history.
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  20

  I was two people at once, were you?

  by christopherceo in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  oh yeah, i did it.

  i lived the double life and nobody ever found out.

  i did all the things a pioneer/servant was supposed to do.

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  Far North

  I guess I am two people at once right now. My heart is not in the "truth" but I am keeping up with it for the sake of the family. I attend many of the meetings although I told my wife I refuse to take the bookstudy seriously till they start studying something of interest. (probably won't happen) I've set boundaries as to what I will and won't do. I have not been out in service for a long time and refuse to go. How can I persuade others to join something I don't fully believe.

  The intersting thing is that my life hasn't fallen apart like would be expected. I have a good job in management, I'm faithful to my patient, wonderful wife and am even losing weight for health reasons. My kids still love me (last time I checked) and we are't the Osborns.

  On the suggestion from some of you I am taking it slow but am starting to understand things better as if a cloud is slowly being lifted. I don't have any privledges in the congo because I am inactive and don't care although I really miss handling the roving mics. It gave me such a sense of control. (HA!)

  I view myself as not so much a hypocrite then as being in transition.

  By the way, I was always told people like you were supposed to be crazy and irrational and so full of hatred and possesed that they couldn't reason on anything. You're not supposed to make so much sense!
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  21

  OBSERVATIONS BY MY THERAPIST

  by Far North in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  my last therapy session was all about the "truth".

  after many sessions i finally brought up the thought that maybe some of my depression and low self-esteem issues have to do with spending 40 years in a high-control religion.. i won't bore you with all the details but some of the highlights of what i said bothers me are:.

  my never feeling like i am doing enough or are good enough.. having regrets about missed opportunities and having let others control my life.. constant changing of doctrine and dates.

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  Far North

  Thanks for the words of encouragement and advice.

  It looks like my journey has begun.....

  I'll stay in touch.
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  21

  OBSERVATIONS BY MY THERAPIST

  by Far North in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  my last therapy session was all about the "truth".

  after many sessions i finally brought up the thought that maybe some of my depression and low self-esteem issues have to do with spending 40 years in a high-control religion.. i won't bore you with all the details but some of the highlights of what i said bothers me are:.

  my never feeling like i am doing enough or are good enough.. having regrets about missed opportunities and having let others control my life.. constant changing of doctrine and dates.

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  Far North

  My last therapy session was all about the "truth". After many sessions I finally brought up the thought that maybe some of my depression and low self-esteem issues have to do with spending 40 years in a high-control religion.

  I won't bore you with all the details but some of the highlights of what I said bothers me are:

  My never feeling like I am doing enough or are good enough.

  Having regrets about missed opportunities and having let others control my life.

  Constant changing of doctrine and dates. (Having the rug pulled out from under you).

  After explaining to her the option of disassociation and the shunning by friends and family that would follow, her comment was: "Those men (Elders) exercise a lot of power and control to hold such a threat over your head. No wonder your depressed!." She works for the hospital and is not a minister but she began to talk about the example of the prodical son and how God draws and forgives those who are searching and hurting. She asked me about God's love shown by sending his Son to die for us to save us through faith and not just works..

  I thought I was the one supposed to be sharing good news with others and not the other way around!

  I hate to admit it, but after 40 years in the truth I feel like I have no hope for salvation because I will never make the grade. I can never do enough to be "whole-souled". Everything I have done in the past is negated because of my present spiritually "sick" condition. Jehovah is an exacting God who has no problem destroying the majority of mankind, so what chance do I have? When people say Jesus came to die for us and Jehovah is a God of compassion and mercy I still don't think I have any chance to be one of the "spared ones.

  How did my perception get so screwed up? I have been a pioneer, and Elder and a Bethelite. I have sacrificed and obeyed (usually). What went wrong? Where is the joy and peace of mind? I'm not looking for sympathy, but is it just me? What did I miss along the way?

  I'm not looking for a bitch-session but some thought provoking comments from others who may have or are currently feeling similar. If i'm just a screw-up I can deal with that, but somewhere along the way something went wrong or I missed some signal that others claim to have seen.
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  19

  tree awnd forest

  by comforter in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  if tree fall in forest with no one around to hear it, it make a sound?

  dont it deepend on howe you denote sound?

  if sound dependent on human perkeption, the tree make no sound.

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  Far North

  If a pioneer preached in a forest and there was no one there to hear it, could they still count their time?
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  22

  Survey about Depression & Therapy

  by ESTEE in

  1. jw
  2. experiences

  i would really like to hear your opinion on this topic:.

  you know how the jws look down their nose on a person who falls into depression?

  i am curious how many people here think that if you have been in therapy that you are emotionally weak.

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  Far North

  I have been using antidepressants for a few years now and finally have also begun therapy sessions. I trace my depression back to about age 11 but always attributed it to some spiritual shortcoming of my own. Right now I am dealing with the issues of low self-esteem and anxiety. I'm not a basket case but I really didn't fear death. It seemed like the potential for a good rest.

  After several sessions I finally blurted out that I feel part of my problem comes from being raised in a high-control religion. Then I apologized several times about not wanting to bring reproach. The therapist assured me she is not there to judge. It should be an interesting next session.
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  17

  Does every verse of Isaiah apply to today?

  by Far North in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  last night at the book study they spent an entire hour covering 11 verses in the book of isaiah.

  using pictures and scriptures from all over the bible every verse has a lesson for us today.

  is this really true or is it just talented writing?

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  Far North

  Last night at the book study they spent an entire hour covering 11 verses in the book of Isaiah. Using pictures and scriptures from all over the Bible every verse has a lesson for us today. Is this really true or is it just talented writing? When my wife wondered why I miss so many Book Studies I told her I think it's redundant to spend three years doing a verse by verse study of Isaiah. By the time you get ready for the meeting, go and come back you have spent two hours studying a few verses you can read in two minutes.

  In the study last night they were all over the place making application of Rutherford's imprisonment, token service and Nazi persecution. The point was made that those who fell away when the end didn't come in 1914 were the impurities skimmed off the top of the refined metal. The conductor said that those who fell away after 1975 or who leave today because they get tired of waiting are also imputities being skimmed off the organization. I almost yelled out, "If the organization didn't make so many false predictions maybe there would be less disappointed people!".

  Maybe some day I'll have the backbone to say it. Maybe it's time for me to be skimmed off! In the meantime I look for any excuse I can to miss the bookstudy. Like I told my wife, "In fifteen years they will write another Isaiah book and it will all be changed!" I think of the hundreds of Book Studies I attended as we studied the Babylon The Great book over and over again in the 1960's and how much was changed in the Revelation Climax book. I should of used the time to take some night courses at the community college.

  Off the subject, the next time I screw up at work I'm going to tell managment they can't get upset with me because I now have new light on how to do things and this is only revealed to me gradually, usually after the fact so I can't be held accountable for my mistakes and they need to continue to have perfect trust in me. Then I'll ask for a big raise!
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  44

  Where do I go for support???

  by scaredyetresolved in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  i would love some support since i am scared and confused, but i don't know where to turn.

  my husband and i are both having our eyes opened wide after years of doubts.

  we have finally read the "apostate literature" over the past few weeks and have checked and rechecked their sources.

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  Far North

  Scaredbutresolved, I hope you don't mind that I jumped into the middle of your forum. What you were talking about struck a cord. I thank everyone for their support and suggestions.

  At this point I am going to take it slow and be carefull how I approach things. My issues are not with people. Most of the people in the organization are trying to be Christians, they are just overwhelmed by rules and a devotion to an organization that does not tolerate questions or personal expression.

  I am slowly letting my wife in on my doubts. She has thought I was only upset with organizational proceedures and people. The other day she asked me if I had a problem with any of the doctrine and I told her, yes. Slowly and calmly I mentioned the 144,000 which number I believe is figurative like everything around it in Revelation 7 & 14. Then I mentioned the Blood issue which hardly makes sense anymore and suggested that it is a dietary law. Our bodies do not eat or digest transfused blood and it is not the same as being fed intraveniously. I also briefly mentioned all the failed prophesy which impacted both our lives, making the last 25 years an economic struggle because of us not getting any training or additional schooling.

  What brought this on is that I have been seeing a therapist for the last several months. The major issues have been depression and anxiety along with a feeling of worthlessness. I have been taking antidepressants for a few years but was not making progress with these issues. I also had no concern if I lived or died. I am not suicidal or a cowering idiot. I function and have a good marriage and hold a job in management. I just had no joy but instead a feeling of worthlessness.

  Part of the therapy is working thru these issues so one can at least minimize their impact on one's life. After several sessions I have made progress but I sensed the Therapist was a litttle dissapointed with my slow improvement especially with the issue of feeling I am a failure. Whenever the therapy got overwhelming I was told to go to my 'safe place' in my mind, a place from the past where I felt loved and safe and happy. Interestingly my 'safe place' is in my grandparents living room as a child surrounded by family and cousins and the Christmas tree in the corner. I mentioned to my wife that this was before we became Witnesses and our relationship with our family became strained. Interestingly I couldn't think of a safe place since then. I think it's a combination of the facts that ever since I have been in the truth my thoughts have been ruled by feelings of impending doom and that I never have been good enough.

  Finally towards the end of the session as she was trying to draw me out I just said that I feel these issues go back from being raised in a high-control religion that always made me feel inadequate. I couldn't believe I said that. She said she sensed there was something I was not talking about. I apologized over and over again telling her that I have spent my whole life trying to present the Organization in a good light to others and I feel like a traitor speaking negativly about it to a non-member.

  She assured me she is not there to judge me or the Witnesses, just to help me work thru it. I later mentioned to my wife how different this is compared to if I approached the Elders with these same issues. They would try to help and if I didn't respond like they wanted, we know what the end result would be.

  I will keep you posted. Thank you for your concern and please pray for me. Right now I can't do it myself.

  F
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  44

  Where do I go for support???

  by scaredyetresolved in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  i would love some support since i am scared and confused, but i don't know where to turn.

  my husband and i are both having our eyes opened wide after years of doubts.

  we have finally read the "apostate literature" over the past few weeks and have checked and rechecked their sources.

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  Far North

  I too am caught in what seems a situation with no escape. (This is my first post.) I have been baptized for almost 40 years and no longer have a love for the 'truth' or a strong trust of the organization. I have pioneered, been an Elder and served at Bethel.

  I would leave today, but my greatest fear is what it will do to my family. All my family and friends are in the organization. How can I leave without tearing apart my family. How can I tell my grown children most of what the were taught is incorrect?

  My wife thinks I am just bitter over people and organizational procedures but my problem is not with the people but with the mind-control, the false doctrine, the false dates and the way I let myself be manipulated all these years.

  It's like knowing you need an operation but wonder if the cure is going to be harder to live with than the ailment.

  Far North